originally posted by Erik-Berndt Scheper
Well, there's something else that struck me, which hasn't been covered yet. The preview above states that Asandir entered the Koriani sisterhouse at Whitehold, which is in Eltair Bay, Melhalla if I'm correct.
But the end of SF, Asandir has told Elaira that the Prime Matriarch means to retire in and sulk in seclusion at Forthmark, which is a city in Vastmark, Shand.
Any suggestions?
originally posted by Clansman
The Whitehold sisterhouse was chosen to impress. It wouldn't take long for Selidie to travel there with her entourage after licking her wounds. I don't see the change of locales as significant beyond Selidie's stated purpose, but I have often completely missed important details like this before in this series.
Janny is a crafty, cunning tale-spinner, after all.
originally posted by Jo
SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER
Wasn't Sulfin supposed to meet Arithon 3 times? Something to do with killing not killing him. Can't quite remember and could be wrong. Once in the cave, once on the boat and there must be another meeting.
originally posted by Auna
Spoiler
I don't think we are done with Sulfin, there is the matter of the oath he swore and the ultimate choice implied - land or Lysaer. I really expect this to come to a head at some point. I don't think the boat scene quite cut it in regard to this tidbit.
Short of re-reading everything again, I can't think of any situation where the Fellowship 'lost' to Morriel or made any type of bargain with Koriani. 200 years would mean Morriel's lifetime or Morriel as Seledie. I'm betting on something new that we didn't know about but probably should have seen coming.
originally posted by Brittani
I just realized something.
At the end of SF after Asandir puts the F7 flag at Alestron it says something like Asandir said that Alestron would be sealed until the Paravian's come to judge - but then the ending - where 'for centuries' the passersby noticed that the F7 flag on the topmost keep didn't fade.
I wonder if that is a hint?? It would imply that either the Paravians did not come back for centuries, the Paravians did not give Alestron back to the S'Brydian and the flag just stayed there or the S'Brydian all died so there was no one to claim the fortress.
Maybe it is a hint that in fact the next book will be starting a couple of centuries after the end of SF. I just don't feel like enough of the lose ends were tied up to be able to jump ahead several hundred years. Just think of all of the major events that happen over the course of decades much less centuries.
originally posted by Julian Miller
I'd just like to make my first post on this here site to say, ouch!. I'm going to be wondering about that snippet till the book comes out!.
An intriguing turn of events indeed.
Hi - Welcome here Julian Miller!
originally posted by Aria
Hee come out of lurkerdom again and what do I find? 
Thank you, Janny!
My thought on the snippet was that it was 200 years after the events in Fugitive Prince, and it was referring to Morriel's takeover of Selidie. But then I reread. :s
Bah! It's been too long since I read the series (including Stormed Fortress -I managed to find it in the shop before the Pub. date) and now stupid exams mean that I can't reread any time soon. 
Still, very intriguing Janny and good luck with writing the rest to the deadline that YOU want (and not what other people -other than the Publisher- says).
originally posted by Hunter
Whether or not the "bitter defeat" was before or after the setting of SF, the next question is why Morriel took 200 years to call due the debt? It's clear through the series that the Koriathain hoard debts and use them at the time of their choosing. If Morriel did have a debt over the Fellowship, what circumstances might prompt her to call in such a debt?
originally posted by Zorana Lewis
Spoiler and all that jazz
The thing that springs to mind with me is that in SF Morriel/Selidie comments on her 'annoyance' (to put it mildly) about how Elaira managed to have Arithon's daughter fall out of their control, when something similar happened with Dari s'Ahelas way back when.
So could it not be that the birth of Arithon's daughter is what prompted the call of debt?
originally posted by Clansman
Zorana:
You'd better pick up "Child of Prophecy", which is the short story that explains the Dari s'Ahelas events. I don't believe the two are even remotely related, due mostly to the contents of that story.
originally posted by Zorana Lewis
Now that is one that I'm struggling to get hold of. No book store in Birmingham seems to stock it, and Waterstones and Borders don't even have it on their inventory so I can order it. (and yeah, before anybody asks, I am asking for 'The Masters of Fantasy ed. Bill Fawcett, and NOT simply Child of Prophecy by Janny Wurts. lol) *sighs* Amazon have it, but after a bit of a 'disagreement' with them, they locked down my account so I can't shop with them anymore.
But cool. I'll do my best to read it, but it's just finding the durned thing. lol.
originally posted by Meredith Lee Gray
SPOILER FOR SF and CoP:
Clansman,
I don't think the two are related, but I think Zorana has a point about the similarity of the instances. Bear with me, because it's been a while since I've read Child of Prophecy.
But in both situations, the Koriathain were thiiiis close to getting their greasy mitts on a child of royal birth, but in both instances they lost out. In CoP, the Fellowship had a more direct intervention. But even in SF, the Fellowship played some role in pulling the unborn child clear of Koriani machinations (well, so far).
Mer
originally posted by Clansman
My point, which I should have taken the trouble to actually state, was that the birth of Dari s'Ahelas was not the bitter defeat. It was too long ago, and it was a downright victory, as the wee bairn was almost in the clutches of the Twisted Sisters when-
ah, but that would be telling. Obviously, it didn't happen, but I won't tell Zorana about the ending here. Suffice to say, it was not a bitter defeat. Nor was Arithon and Glendien's union. If anyone got defeated, it was the Koriathain, not the F7.
originally posted by Meredith Lee Gray
Sorry, I guess I misunderstood. I didn't read Zorana's original post as her saying that she thought Dari's birth was the 'bitter defeat.' I thought she was just commenting on the similarity of those situations.
No, obviously the timeline's would not be correct for that, as you say.
Mer
originally posted by Zorana Lewis
I didn't mean to imply is was the 'bitter defeat' either. lol.
What I meant to imply was that in SF it states that the Koriani had failed to get hold of Dari (told in CoP; though do remember I've never read this *g*) and that the same has just happened again with Arithon's daughter (AD). So, is it not possible that Morriel is now going to desperate measures to try and get AD…or indeed thinks shes found a loophole from some old debt that means she thinks she can claim AD for the Koriathain?
As for the time issue, the sentence in question is:on a morning well over two centuries ago
Which does kinda raise the point that it is more than two centuries…
But *shrugs* Yeah. I really need to get my mitts on CoP. Stop me making daft assumptions.
originally posted by Meredith Lee Gray
SF SPOILERS AHEAD (I guess I don't need to post this, since the thread title warns it?)
Zorana,
FWIW, I agree with your daft assumptions, having read CoP. I'm glad you clarified, because originally that was what I thought you meant. That due to again missing out on an opportunity to claim a royal child by default (or, heck, even just trumping Arithon for once), they are calling in this debt.
I think that the morning in question would be closer to the 200 year mark though. Otherwise, Janny probably would have written "close to three centuries ago" or "over three/four/five/etc. centuries ago". So I think we should be checking for events that occurred 200-250 years ago. Since the verbiage is "well over two centuries" it is probably not near the 200 year mark, though.
Hunter is absolutely right in that it's (perhaps even more) important to wonder what prompted Morriel to cash in this particular chip–obviously the 'bitter defeat' that brought on the debt is a momentous event. So is it due to missing out on claiming Arithon's daughter that Morriel is now resorting to desperate measures? Or has something else happened that we don't know about yet? And why has Morriel or the F7 never reflected on the owing of this debt? Or have they, and we've just missed it?
Mer
originally posted by Zorana Lewis
Meredith,
As far as timing goes, you're probably right to say it's around the 200 mark. And the only thing I can find that happens around 200 years ago is Ciladis going to look for the Paravians, which he does in 5462. He never comes back, and he never finds the Paravarians…well, he might have done, but he never comes back to tell the F7 about them.
That's certainy a bitter defeat as far as the F7 are concerned, but how that involves the Koriani? *shrugs* beats me.
originally posted by Meredith Lee Gray
Yeah, that's pretty much the only thing anyone's been able to come up with for what happened at that approximate time.
But as you say, what does it have to do with the Koriani?
Maybe, some time after Ciladis disappeared and Sethvir could not longer track/locate him, they asked the Koriani to scry for him for some reason. Maybe they have some secret or special way of searching that was beyond what the Fellowship could do. With one of their fancy-schmancy crystals. If the Fellowship asked a favor such as that, you can bet the Koriani would milk it for all it was worth… Just a random supposition.
Mer
originally posted by Brittani
Maybe it has something to do with how Sethvir ended up with the waystone. Some how or another the Koriani lost their big stone during the uprising I think and that could be considered the bitter defeat.